Not sure where you read that, but DAB in L-Band was a massive failure, a brief trial was done in Australia, but Canada actually used DAB in L-Band & it was a big fail, so they stopped using it, & in fact DAB use in L-band has since been removed from the transmission standards, DAB can now only be used in VHF Band 3.
3 Likes
What does SiriusXM use in the US/Canada?
SiriusXM use S-Band Satellite & MPEG compression in the USA/Canada, what type of MPEG & what data rate I’m not sure.
1 Like
The decision as to which form of Digital Radio to use should be made on technical grounds rather than solely whats commercially the best option. That said, DAB could work commercially - but its the incumbent operators who have made the decision for it not to as a way of protecting the ‘lead’ stations.
You’ve got to wonder whether there would be an accelerated rollout if the industry wasn’t having to fund the rollout itself. Digital television got significant help from the Government (and may get more if there is persistence with the proposed restack) but it also returned a significant dividend by the way of redistributable spectrum allocations.
The value proposition that digital radio offers simply isn’t there in comparison to its television equivalent which makes it harder to justify the public expenditure to support a transition and frankly the almost anti-competitive attitude of parts of the industry makes it even harder.
4 Likes
I’m not sure what the fuss is about DAB being a failure, because it hasn’t been.
I remember when it first launched in Brisbane in 2009, at the same time as the TV stations started launching new digital stations like One, Go, 7Two etc.
It’s success was based on more choice of formats, e.g. ABC Dig, Grandstand, Koffee, Novanation, Radar, 4KQ plus, Edge etc. It also gave the AM music stations the chance to broadcast in crystal clear stereo. Nothing wrong with that.
True, it could have been opened up to new competitors, but the problem is the capacity was nearly used up and the incumbents wanted the remaining capacity to launch new formats, which I can understand, as they helped to fund it’s rollout.
The difference between Australia and the UK is a lack of capacity, it’s as simple as that. If the Fed gov decides to grant a new frequency for more DAB capacity, i.e. a fourth mux in Syd, Mel, Bris and a third in Ade and Perth, then there will be more opportunities for independents to lease more spectrum from the incumbents, as it would most likely be auctioned off in 32kbs lots, with a maximum of 128kbs per existing FM / AM station in each market.
3 Likes
There is no review into L band currently nor will there be for DAB, I don’t know where you’re getting that info from?
Community Radio won’t be on DAB in L Band at any time in the future, no matter how much the current labor Government might want to put it there.
I operate & maintain the DAB transmitters in Sydney & Melbourne as my day job, L Band isn’t being looked into for DAB use, & won’t be.
Mode II for L-Band, Earth and satellite
Mode III for frequencies below 3 GHz, Earth and satellite
Mode IV for L-Band, Earth and satellite
were all removed from the DAB transmission specifications back in January 2017, leaving only Mode I for VHF Band 3, Earth.
5 Likes
Sadly it is errors on forums like this that start rumours and off the miss Information goes off and running 
5 Likes
Interesting article about RNZ buying a new DRM Tx for their Pacific service:
RNZ obviously see value in shortwave DRM for its direct coverage and as a program feed for their FM rebroadcasts in the pacific. Their experience of shortwave DRM must have been rock solid for them to use it to feed FM rebroadcasts - it will also save on satellite costs.
5 Likes
Correct @dutymainttech, they’re the exact reasons RNZ have mentioned in any publicity. DRM is offering significant benefits.
I an loathe to use superlatives to exaggerate, however DRM is indeed transformative for RNZ’s needs.
Domestically, the ABC could offer high quality, modern coverage without the vagaries of SW to all Australians. The entire landmass could be covered.
3 Likes
You must have a different ACMA site to me, I get a 404 error if I try to open that link & there’s no reference to that if I search the ACMA web site?
I did however find this one, if this is the one you’re talking about? https://www.acma.gov.au/consultations/2022-05/review-15-ghz-band-consultation-162022
Like I said, L-Band trials for DAB use were a failure when done years ago, both here & overseas, & DAB use in L-band for satellite or Earth use was removed from the DAB transmission standards.
For ACMA to make up a transmission standard to use DAB in L-band (Satellite) would have to be internationally agreed & the mode put back in the DAB transmission standards, highly unlikely to happen & as it was previously removed, highly unlikely for there to be any receivers capable of receiving it & highly unlikely to get any manufacturers to make any for an Australian only market, where DAB terrestrially isn’t that highly listened to over AM/FM or other formats.
And I think you may have misunderstood what it actually says?
This is an excerpt from the document, it doesn’t say they are looking to use DAB in L-Band, it says there’s an allowance in the rules to use L-band for (digital sound broadcasting), which could be anything, like the radio services what’s broadcast on VAST & other satellites, it also says that (like I said) the option to use DAB in L-band was removed back in 2017 & while the option is still there/space reserved in l-band for digital sound broadcasting, ACMA says they don’t see any interest in using it & aren’t aware of any planned use of it for that purpose in Australia.
Broadcasting and broadcasting-satellite services
Allocations to the broadcasting and broadcasting-satellite (both intended for digital sound broadcasting (DSB)) services were made in the 1452–1492 MHz frequency range at the WARC-92. Not long after this, a frequency band plan was made to preserve options for possible terrestrial and satellite DSB use.
While trials were carried out in Australia during the 1990s and 2000s, the DSB allocation in the 1.5 GHz band has remained unused for broadcasting services domestically.
In 2017, an update to the Digital Audio Broadcasting (DAB) standard removed transmission modes II, III, and IV, leaving only mode I. Modes II and IV were the only modes that previously supported operation in the 1452–1492 MHz frequency range. Mode I is intended to be used for terrestrial Single Frequency Networks (SFN) and local area broadcasting in VHF Bands I, II and III.
Australia is the notifying administration for the satellite filing of an existing operational satellite network that provides digital sound and multimedia satellite broadcasting services to Asia in the 1467–1492 MHz frequency range.
However, this filing does not service Australia. We are not aware of any planned use of the band for DSB in Australia.
3 Likes
From memory that is close to the GPS frequencies - L Band DAB+ stuffing everyones GPS would really get it noticed!
2 Likes
The logical place for DRM would be on 86-87mhz as compatibility with some current FM combiners and antenna systems would make the implementation of this easy and cost effective.
However I doubt that will ever happen.
2 Likes
I’m really not sure what to say to that?
You talking about what could be, can’t be & wont be.
I’m not sure you grasp the terminology (maybe), of different types of digital radio, DAB is a format of digital radio like AM & FM are formats of Analogue Radio.
Web streaming is digital radio, radio on VAST is digital radio, same as radio on other satellite platforms, radio on the DTV multiplexes for ABC & SBS are digital radio, but none of those are DAB.
As I’ve repetitively said, the use of DAB in L-Band has been removed from the international DAB transmission standards, yes digital radio in some form may be used in L-band in Australia in the future, but it won’t be DAB, it can’t be.
As for China using DAB in L-band in Shanghai, China doesn’t stick to international standards, they do whatever they please, probably some local manufacturer makes receivers to pick it up that aren’t available outside China, because it’s not used & is not part of a internationally useable transmission standard.
Nothing stopping SiriusXM or anyone else coming here & putting a digital radio service on L-band in Australia, but community radio, narrowcast, national or anyone else won’t be putting a DAB radio service on L-band in Australia or anywhere else.
It could well be DRM, but as yet, that hasn’t been approved for use by the ITU internationally either, so DRM use on any frequency above 174MHz can’t happen until that approval is granted, & the DRM transmission standards change & come under the Digital System G for Sound Broadcasting which will then cover DRM+ use from 30MHz to 3GHz (still with the original DRM specifications of use on frequencies under 30MHz).
4 Likes
Media Spy always amuses me how people argue with people working in the field and people who have inside knowledge
9 Likes
That’s from 2010. Not a lot of domestic shortwave happening in Australia now.
ACMA won’t issue a licence for DAB in the L band because, as explained ad nauseum, it is no longer part of international standards.
As for any other digital radio technology (eg. DRM, DARS), it simply isn’t economically viable for a single broadcaster to invest in something completely new. It’s not the case of merely setting up a new station/multiplex, but also marketing that new platform and waiting on the market to supply new receivers, adapters for cars, etc.
6 Likes
We’ll we can’t live on the AM Band Forever with Crackly Repection.
2 Likes
Out of interest I was looking at what Australian frequency assignments existed just below the current FM BCB on the ACMA site.
There isn’t anything listed between 85.1 & 87.4MHz.
There’s certainly plenty of gov, private biz & other utilities using spectrum between 75 & 85.1 MHz though.
1 Like
Noticed this years ago… thats why I always thought it would be a great place for DRM or DAB+
1 Like
that article is dated, it mentions the Shepparton transmitters which have since been de-commissioned and the land already sold for housing.
3 Likes
In introducing a new standard, a super crucial question is what is the value proposition for the listener?
More choice? I get that with DAB+ already, and if I don’t like the song I’ll find something to listen to on Spotify or Apple Music, or listen to a podcast, or watch Youtube, or consume a different form of media entirely.
Audio quality? DAB+ can do really high quality audio, but the networks starve stations of bitrate to fit more services in. There’s no reason why DRM (or another standard) would be any different, sans regulating a minimum bit rate for services, but there’s not a chance in hell of the Federal Government increasing any regulation of the sector.
SXM is a subscription service that has cost billions in technology and content development over 20 years, and has the reach to serve a population ten times larger than Australia. Not even CRA’s cabal has or will pour that much money into DAB+.
Again, even if the spectrum is free, you will never make back the initial capex and opex investments to justify the expense. It’s not just a technological investment, but a marketing and programming one.
4 Likes