Digital Radio

Yup, all Metallica all October.
Had trouble getting out of bed this morning - Triple M hard n Heavy did the trick.
I’m sure my blood pressure is elevated now to - just need a strong coffee to be really buzzing…

I’ve now found my ideal alarm clock (radio station) to catch my early am flights.

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As someone who lamented the loss of Triple M Modern in January this year and with the introduction of Triple M Hard N Heavy today, I just thought I’d note that Triple M Aussie has consistently dropped ratings in most markets every single survey and is sitting as the worst or second worst performing station in total people for most markets. Triple M Country isn’t doing great either but at least there’s a point of difference there.

Bring back Triple M Modern :slight_smile:

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Latest dump from DAB player for the 9A multiplex here in Hobart. All stations using HE-AAC v2 except for Ultra, 7RPH and Hobart FM which use HE-AAC v1.

Ensemble 0x1380, Label: 'DAB+ HOBART', ShortLabel: 'DAB+ HB', LTO: +600 min, ECC: 0xF0, NumServices: 12
    Audio-Service 0x1380, Label: '7HOFM', ShortLabel: '7HOFM', PTY: Pop Music (dynamic), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 1, StartCU: 192, NumCU: 30, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 40 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 0
    Audio-Service 0x1381, Label: 'Kix Country', ShortLabel: 'Kix', PTY: Country Music (dynamic), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 2, StartCU: 222, NumCU: 24, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 32 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 0
    Audio-Service 0x1382, Label: '7HO Classic Hits', ShortLabel: '7HO Clas', PTY: Pop Music (dynamic), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 3, StartCU: 246, NumCU: 24, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 32 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 0
    Audio-Service 0x1390, Label: 'Triple M HOBART', ShortLabel: 'Triple M', PTY: Other Music (static), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 17, StartCU: 0, NumCU: 36, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 48 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 1
            User App 1 / 1, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', UaType: 0x2 (Slideshow), DataLen: 0 []
    Audio-Service 0x1391, Label: 'Hit100.9', ShortLabel: 'Hit100.9', PTY: Pop Music (static), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 18, StartCU: 36, NumCU: 36, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 48 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 1
            User App 1 / 1, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', UaType: 0x2 (Slideshow), DataLen: 0 []
    Audio-Service 0x1393, Label: 'MMM CLASSIC ROCK', ShortLabel: 'MMMCLASS', PTY: Rock Music (static), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 20, StartCU: 72, NumCU: 30, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 40 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 1
            User App 1 / 1, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', UaType: 0x2 (Slideshow), DataLen: 0 []
    Audio-Service 0x1396, Label: 'OLDSKOOL HITS', ShortLabel: 'OLDSKOOL', PTY: -, NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 23, StartCU: 102, NumCU: 30, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 40 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 1
            User App 1 / 1, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', UaType: 0x2 (Slideshow), DataLen: 0 []
    Audio-Service 0x1397, Label: 'Hit Easy', ShortLabel: 'Hit Easy', PTY: Easy Listening Music (static), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 24, StartCU: 132, NumCU: 30, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 40 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 1
            User App 1 / 1, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', UaType: 0x2 (Slideshow), DataLen: 0 []
    Audio-Service 0x1398, Label: 'MMM COUNTRY', ShortLabel: 'MMMCNTRY', PTY: Country Music (static), NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 25, StartCU: 162, NumCU: 30, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 40 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 1
            User App 1 / 1, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', UaType: 0x2 (Slideshow), DataLen: 0 []
    Audio-Service 0x13B0, Label: '7RPH Print Radio', ShortLabel: '7RPH', PTY: -, NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 50, StartCU: 336, NumCU: 48, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 64 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 0
    Audio-Service 0x13B1, Label: 'Ultra 106.5', ShortLabel: 'Ultra', PTY: -, NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 49, StartCU: 288, NumCU: 48, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 64 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 0
    Audio-Service 0x13B3, Label: 'Hobart FM', ShortLabel: 'HobartFM', PTY: -, NumComponents: 1 (Audio: 1, Data: 0)
        AudioComponent, SCIdS: 0, Label: '', ShortLabel: '', ASCTy: 0x3F (AAC), SubChId: 51, StartCU: 384, NumCU: 48, ErrorProt: EEP 3-A (FEC: 1/2), Datarate: 64 kbit/s, NumUserApps: 0
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Interesting read about DRM use in Australia, note & not surprised CRA are pretty much the only ones opposed to it’s use.

As I’ve stated here so many times before, CRA are so self centred they are killing radio, with the very hand that feeds them.
DAB+ was pushed by & is all about CRA, not the broadcasters & not the listeners.

From radioinfo: DRM not Inferior But Complementary (for use in Australia).

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I’m worried that they quote Alan Hughes (alanh) from the DTV Forums though…

DRM is likely the technically superior choice for regional Australia but as with other battles in the technological space, economics, marketing, and politics will be the decisive factors. Look no further than the muddle that is the NBN (the other one) for proof of that.

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Broken clocks and all that…

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Does DRM provide the same scope for additional stations as DAB? Because honestly for me the extra stations available is the only reason I listen to radio anymore otherwise I’d just be streaming overseas stations or Spotify.

Whatever the history of choosing DAB I think it’s too late to add another new platform. In recent submissions to ACMA on the future options for radio it wasn’t just CRA that were negative on DRM and the overwhelming number of them supported DAB whilst still acknowledging the challenges in regional Australia. But the truth is the population in the truly regional and remote areas where DRM would work best wouldn’t be sufficient to encourage commercial broadcasters to adopt it IMO

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Is alanh still active online anywhere? His posts were informative, yet his forum etiquette was unique.

Similar to Rod Speed from the old Usenet days.

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The most obvious regulatory regime would be to give a 100kHz channel for each analogue license owned. This can deliver a range of different bit rates depending on protection levels, however a good middle ground option delivers 149kbps (16-QAM PL2) - which is as I understand it very similar in robustness to what DAB+ uses, so coverage characteristics would be similar (though DRM+ would allow far more planning flexibility).

So 149kbps per station would be more than the 128kbps allocated under DAB+, though obviously less than some broadcasters would get after participating in a DAB excess capacity auction.

However if I were designing a DRM+ rollout, I’d be auctioning some national frequencies to new entrants, which would be a great way to boost uptake of the new format - and there’d certainly be the capacity for it if we used Band I DRM+.

The DTV Forums were consumed by “StereoNET” - last I looked he was active there.

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Ah yes, AlanH! His posts were often controversial - resulting in a number of disagreements with other forumers over who was correct! I always did like reading dtvforum.info :smile:

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Who says? and why?
I believe similar things were said when FM was starting to be introduced!

Pretend your a regional broadcaster for a minute and you have several services in small towns like the size of Roma QLD.

Would you spend $250k+ to install DAB+ and it only covers the town?
Would you spend $50k to install DRM/DRM+ and it covers most of your coverage area?
Would you like the fact you have to get into a Joint venture with your competitor or would you prefer to do it alone?

If your answers are 50k and alone then its a no brainer and DRM is the way to go!

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I’ve noticed too no DAB signal in my Mitsubishi ASX south of Movie World heading towards Gold Coast.

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Just my opinion but the reason I think it’s too late is by the time they get DRM up and running, and get receivers in homes and cars streaming would have already taken over. Look at how long it’s taken to get DAB into cars! The window has well and truly passed. Towns that are too small to make DAB viable will most likely stick with AM/FM. The larger ones will go with DAB because that’s what’s already in cars and homes.

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I would say the key point is, how much DAB+ rollout do you do before deciding that it is totally unsuitable for the task of covering the diverse markets of regional Australia.

The idea of tiny plots of DAB coverage scattered around a market, is a non-starter. No regional broadcaster is going to roll out 5 transmitter sites to cover less than they do from 1 FM tower.

The ACMA or Government moving to identify DRM+ as a technology option for digital radio, allocating spectrum for it and clarifying the policy procedures for licensing it - you can let the market decide if it succeeds.

It will be tough to break the lead DAB+ has - but as regional stations are faced with the logistical issues of trying to actually deploy DAB+ in their markets, and sub-metro community/narrowcast stations have no digital options at all, DRM+ will look attractive to many.

Obviously the CRA’s problem with DRM+ is because it doesn’t have the spectrum scarcity and inflexibility of DAB+, which they used effectively to lock out new competition.

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Streaming is often quoted around here as being THE thing, & it’ll end all broadcasting, fact is you’re believing all the bullshit people with self interest are telling & wanting you to believe (just like CRA & DAB+).
Most streaming radio services, whether it’s a copy of their on air, or standalone online streaming station, will have at any one time less than 5000 concurrent listeners online.
Yes there’s probably a few 100,000 online streaming stations around the world, but most will have less than 500 people worldwide listening at an one time.

As I type this now, there are a total of 799,072 people listening to all Shoutcast server stations around the world, there’ll be more than that on other servers like Icecast, & networks who host there own servers, etc. but Shoutcast servers are the biggest, so that gives you some idea of just how many listeners online stations around the world have (or don’t have) compared with on air. The station with the most current listeners is varying between just under 9000, & about 10,500 listeners, there’s a couple of others close around 5-7000 then they drop off fast, there’s currently only 13 stations worldwide on the Shoutcast servers who have over 1000 listeners.

Streaming isn’t a threat to broadcast radio albeit AM/FM or digital DAB/DRM, now or in the next 20 years.
The real threat is advertising revenue going forward, & the huge costs to build a DAB network, with multiple translators to cover what is now, or can be covered with 1 AM/FM or DRM transmitter.

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I’d say we’re done now, put the brakes on DAB+ NOW & look at DRM.

I agree with the rest of your post too, but note ACMA have been reserving spectrum for DRM use since around 2005, all AM Frequencies vacated since then are reserved for DRM use, as is VHF Band 1 unless it’s reallocated internationally for something else.

ACMA weren’t the ones who pushed or decided on DAB+, right from the start they said & supported DRM use for moving Australia into digital radio. CRA talked the Government (Communications Minister) of the time into using DAB+ & making it the standard digital radio platform for Australia, ACMA then had to backtrack, replan & re-engineer spectrum use for DAB+.

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Welcome to the tail wagging the dog - i’d say it needs to change, but we have a media industry that has been built on the back of the industry dictating the terms

But you’re not losing listeners to another radio service (albeit delivered via streaming) - you’re losing listeners to the likes of Apple Music, Google Play Music and Spotify

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Yeah, but lets just take Spotify for an example, they have around 230 million subscribers worldwide, pin prick on the number of broadcast radio listeners, even if every single one is listening to Spotify at the same time.

Spotify I don’t think is a profitable company yet either, so it’s not sustainable, & has been recently spoken about around here, there’s a few of us getting tired with just streaming music, a bit of talk from a jock is more entertaining after a while. Me personally just a few days ago, logged out of my Spotify account & deleted the app, as I no longer listened in & didn’t miss it.

There’s plenty of young people still listening to broadcast radio too, so don’t fall into that bullshit of they no longer listen anymore either, it’s just that it’s not their only form of entertainment now, whereas older generations it was, remember back at the start, TV was going to kill radio, it hasn’t, & streaming of any kind won’t kill or hurt it in the next 15 -20 years either, remember DAB is 24 years old since the first broadcast, the technology is actually over 30 years old, DAB+ is now 13 years old, & nowhere in the world is digital radio the only format of broadcast radio, it still hasn’t killed off FM.

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Norway has switched off FM radio, and Switzerland is gradually about to do the same.

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